Turning the Wheels of Change: Women's Impact in Cycling and introducing Rants of Dissatisfaction

Speaker 1: 1:13

Well, it's time for Road Adventures with Cycling Men of Leisure, the podcast for cyclists who understand that riding is not just about getting to the destination, but the experience along the way. Now here are the original Cycling Men of Leisure Adam and Michael.

Speaker 2: 1:28

Welcome to Road Adventures of Cycling Men of Leisure. I'm Adam and across the table from me digitally is my good friend and co-host, Michael.

Speaker 3: 1:36

Hello, hello, hello, happy to be here again, adam.

Speaker 2: 1:39

Oh see, I haven't replaced you with the AI yet, so that's good.

Speaker 3: 1:43

Yes, another episode that I've not been replaced with AI.

Speaker 2: 1:47

That's right that's right. Awesome.

Speaker 3: 1:50

Doing okay, yeah, not doing too bad. We're starting to get a little winter weather here in Kansas. I got a little snow a few days back, not a lot but a little, so starting to say, hey, winter's coming how about you.

Speaker 2: 2:05

Yeah, we got a little snow and then in the last few days it's been really warm and a lot of rain, so we went from cold to now. We're just going to soak everything and drench everything, but nevertheless it's that time of the season. Unfortunately, it gets dark so fast and can't.

Speaker 3: 2:26

That's still messing me up. It just seems like by the time eight o'clock rolls around, it seems like it should be midnight. I'm still fighting that.

Speaker 2: 2:36

Today I thought we'd do something. You and I started the Cycling Women of Leisure and I thought today we could continue the series and we could talk about all things. Ladies.

Speaker 3: 2:51

I think that would be a great idea. Let me just let me, let me preface this. Let me set the stage, if you will. I'm listening. Did you know, here in our great country, the great country that has museums for everything, one of the reasons why I love it that there are over 51 million Americans who participate in cycling 51 million, 51 million Americans that participate in cycling.

Speaker 2: 3:21

That's pretty cool. I had no idea it was such a large number.

Speaker 3: 3:26

Now why that's relevant to today's conversation is that 28.4% of cyclists are women. Less than 30% of them are women.

Speaker 2: 3:42

I think that's probably from. I mean, I'm just spacing it off with the events that I've been to I would say that's pretty fair. I mean, it's always dominated by men. If you go to, like you and I do, you know state long rides and stuff, there seems to be more men than women.

Speaker 3: 3:58

Yes, when you brought up this topic, I did some research because I was thinking you know, why is there not? Why is that not more equal? I know it'll never be 50%, 50%, but I mean that's a pretty drastic gap. And so I'm like, well, why aren't women getting out there cycling? And as I did my research, I realized that ever since cycling existed, the odds have been stacked against women. It really has. Do you have some examples? I do have some examples.

Speaker 3: 4:33

I just originally thought myself, you know, being an older white guy, it's like, oh well, they just don't get out or they're not interested in cycling or anything like that. But after I did the research I found out that way, way, way back, if we go back to say, the invention of the safety bike, which is basically the bicycle that is kind of the modern day's bicycles predecessor, it's kind of what started us down from the, you know, the penny and farth and got us away from that to like a real type bicycle that we'd recognize today, which is about 1876. Gentlemen by the name of Lawson created that ever since that time. Women, especially in that time, because it was Victorian age, it was very hard for women to go out and start cycling. I mean, men could go out, hop on a bike and ride wherever they wanted to, but there were several things that stood in the woman's way as far as barrier to entry back in the old days when it came to cycling.

Speaker 3: 5:39

And the first one blows my mind that I didn't think of this, and that is you. Let the young ladies get on a bicycle. Well, guess what they can do. Any ideas Go vote.

Speaker 3: 5:58

Well, you're on to something honestly. Back then society was under the end the idea that if women got on bicycles and started cycling more, they would have more mobility, hence more freedom, and society typically the men did not did not like that, so it was very frowned upon for women to get on bicycles and be cycling around back in, you know, the late 1800s. So that was one which makes a lot of sense when you think about the social norms. Number two is look at what women had to wear back in those days. I lived in Newport, rhode Island, for a while and I can remember going into some of the restaurants and the establishments there along the beach areas and they would have the old pictures from like 1920s and they would show you know people out there swimming and the men were in like those, you know one piece singlet things, you know short sleeve shorts and women were out there and pretty much just you know dresses down to their ankle type things and these little you know swimming bonnet things, resistance training. Yeah, that's a lot of drag, let me tell you. So when you think about that, you know women couldn't just go well, I'm going cycling, I'm going to throw in a pair of jeans or pants or shorts, I mean that was so they had to wear like the long skirts when they went cycling, which made cycling very cumbersome, right. So you know who wants to go ride around in a, you know a full length dress and that type of thing. And this is the funny one In the 1890s doctors believed and promoted that if women rode bikes they would become infertile, which you know, think about it back in the Victorian age and stuff.

Speaker 3: 7:50

I mean really society kind of dictated that was kind of the success for a lot of women was. You know what I'm going to get married at a young age and I'm going to have children, and having the children and getting married were like two of the big highlights of society back then. And so if there's doctors out there promoting that, well, I'm not going to get on a bike, you know so. So from the very start, you know so. So from the very start, you know Society and what not kind of had it in for women going against the whole cycling thing.

Speaker 2: 8:21

So men wanted them to get back in the kitchen, and the doctors promoted that, probably while smoking at the same time.

Speaker 3: 8:29

Yeah well, that's healthy for the lungs, you know that's right.

Speaker 2: 8:33

Like those old commercials where the doctors were promoting Philip Morris and cigarettes and stuff.

Speaker 3: 8:41

Oh yes, Things we found out later.

Speaker 2: 8:43

Yes, yes.

Speaker 3: 8:45

And then when I started doing even more research from that period you even look up through the middle of last century you really see that there were bicycles were not making bicycles that were geared towards women, cycling gear was not being made that was geared towards women. So we've really kind of had this long progression to kind of get us to some point where women kind of had an even foothold. And as I'm sitting here talking about this, I feel a little guilty. I mean, there was so much kind of male saying no, no, don't do this, don't do this type thing. So kind of feel guilty about that. Not that I was there doing it, but still, well, you should you, despicable man.

Speaker 3: 9:34

What is interesting to find out is that we finally get up to like 1982. Okay, and have you ever heard of Terry bicycles? I haven't, no, okay, well, terry bicycles was founded by a woman, which was exceptionally unusual back, you know, for a woman to find a found a bicycle company. Georgina Terry founded it and actually in 82, started making the first really modern framed bicycles for women. Okay so, and then specialty followed, or specialized followed, you know, right there, soon after.

Speaker 2: 10:16

And then I think live LIV is a special. I mean, they're designed for women's cycling as well, they are indeed, yeah.

Speaker 3: 10:23

The final thing so now we're starting to get some bicycles, because before they just had to, you know, find frames, very, you know, small men's frames. If they were a smaller gal they'd have to find smaller men's frames. And you look at the difference in height is roughly, you know, four or five inches. So you're like looking, you know you're small, you got to be looking for, you know, small guys bike and you know nowadays, fortunately, since 82, they've started, you know, making bikes more designed to the female body versus the male body. The final thing Clothing. If you were back in the 60s, 70s, 80s, you wanted to go cycling, you were basically going to put on a pair of regular shorts and a t-shirt or something to go cycling in because, unlike the men, they didn't really have, you know, like the kits and things like you have, like the men had.

Speaker 2: 11:23

Okay.

Speaker 3: 11:24

So you know, back then, when the 80s started to roll around, they started saying hey, you know, women are more into cycling, that type of thing. So they decided well, you know what their attitude became with the, now that they had women's specific bicycles well, let's give some women's specific gear. We're not going to go and really do anything special. What we're just going to do is we're going to basically take men's gear and just shrink it down a little, which, if you think about it, that's going to create some obvious issues.

Speaker 2: 12:00

Yeah, I mean so the idea within. I mean just making sure I'm clear. So, taking either the sprocket set front gear and make it a little smaller, well, no, I'm talking specifically the clothing.

Speaker 3: 12:14

Oh, gotcha, gotcha, gotcha, specific clothing. So they just take, like men's, you know, cycling jerseys. We're just going to shrink it down a little bit. And they actually had a great face for it. It was called shrink it and pink it. That was their attitude. We're going to shrink it down and we're going to make it pink and throw some flowers on it to make it appealing to women. It might not fit them very well, but at least it's going to be.

Speaker 3: 12:39

But they're going to look thoroughly, yeah, exactly, Well, maybe depending on how it fit, I guess. So that was interesting. You know, they really just were. They weren't considering, you know, sizes and mass and they weren't looking at the type of cyclist or the body type, they were just. Here's what we got. So, again, it just has been a slow evolution. Finally we get to the new, the new century 2000. And that's really where Trek jumped on board and said hey, they started making true women's apparel, you know, cut design specifically for women. And they also, getting back to the point that you had, just a few minutes ago, started making, you know, like a 26 inch road bike wheel, shorter cranks, things like that that was going to be more fitting towards females.

Speaker 2: 13:30

Gotcha, gotcha. That makes sense. I mean, when Lauren got her first bike, I took her to the bike store and and I remember we bought the bike and we came home and here I had a closet full of, like you know, cycling kits and jerseys that I had, you know, secured at other places, you know, for different rides or events that I had, and I said, oh, I'll just throw this jersey on you. I know that, for a fact, it did not fit her. She looked matter of fact. She came out I said, yeah, let's just throw on a sweatshirt, that doesn't look good. So, but that was another thing where, when they fit her for the bike and and you know, definitely different for for a woman than a man, and that was interesting to see. So, because I was used to you know how, where's your hips, where's the, what size bike do you need, you know? And so for for her to watch some, size her up and everything, it was definitely different, very, very interesting Something.

Speaker 3: 14:33

Yeah, it was. It was interesting, retrospective and really gave me a moment to pause because I didn't really realize that you know, we really have not made our society has not made cycling easy on women. So that really explains that you know 37% of them cycling and not more, because ever since the invention of the bicycle kind of the pressure has been pushed on them not to in fact do that. So it was definitely interesting going down through this and kind of taking a perspective and seeing it. So that's it. Hopefully that kind of sets the stage for why there's not as many women out there riding as as we would like to see.

Speaker 2: 15:23

Yeah, we definitely. You know, we had the ladies join us. Even our team was definitely dominant men versus versus ladies in Georgia last year, and so hopefully this year we can get a few more ladies than we had last year. So let's go.

Speaker 3: 15:44

And the final thing I'm going to leave you with on this topic, adam, do you know what? Where? Where do you know where cycling ranks as far as popularity and outdoor activities in the United States? You know, is it number one, is it number six, is it number 20? I'd say it's in the top 10, but Four wild guess four, it's just a guess. You're very close. Oh man, cycling in the United States is the third most popular outdoor activity.

Speaker 1: 16:13

OK.

Speaker 3: 16:14

Yeah, any ideas what one and two may be?

Speaker 2: 16:18

Pickleball is probably gone like bonds on that.

Speaker 3: 16:21

That hasn't got it. It hasn't got on the list yet.

Speaker 2: 16:24

OK, let's see One and two, then Hiking no.

Speaker 3: 16:30

Hmm, running, running is number one. You'll never guess number two. Ok, I won't even guess. Running is number one. Number two is fishing, really. Number three is cycling.

Speaker 2: 16:43

So yeah, I mean Michigan. There's a lot of fishing. You know those nut jobs that go out on the ice too.

Speaker 3: 16:48

Yeah, and set out there in the wintertime, that's just insane.

Speaker 2: 16:52

The only ice fishing I would do is like in grumpy old men, when they're in those, when in those shanties. They're little huts, yeah the shanties, yeah, with TVs and beer and heaters, and they may look pretty glamorous, but every time I look out there, the wind is whipping. The guys are out there. It doesn't look like that.

Speaker 3: 17:10

Well, maybe you need to get a shanty. It's just your little way of getting away. Yeah, I'm going fishing and you just don't even put. You don't even put anything in the water, you just sit in your shanty and you know, do whatever they do in shanties in Michigan.

Speaker 2: 17:22

Back when I lived in Illinois, the property we had there were five ponds. I used to fish every day and and every now and then I do think about you know, going back to fishing. But but as far as number one, and then running, the only reason to run is if someone steals my bike.

Speaker 3: 17:38

So that's a good point. Yes, someone steals a bike or you're being chased by a bear. That's all I can think of.

Speaker 2: 17:47

As long as I'm not the slowest, Well I figure. If a bear is going to chase me.

Speaker 3: 17:52

Either you or my kids are going to be along with me, so you know.

Speaker 2: 17:58

I think I can take you.

Speaker 3: 17:59

I'm screwed Actually once I think about the kids that actually I'm the slow guy. So yeah, as long as I'm OK if I'm with the family. Yeah, I'm going to.

Speaker 2: 18:10

That doesn't make me feel very good so.

Speaker 3: 18:14

We won't come across any bears. Anyway, getting back to it, that kind of gives you a little history, ok, and I think you did some research on on some of the female cyclists who have stood out and kind of pioneered the sport. So why don't you tell us a little about that?

Speaker 2: 18:35

I will. So women have made some significant, significant achievements in cycling, overcoming the historic barriers, as you mentioned, advocating for equality in the sport, and I've got a few notable accomplishments. So, when it comes to racing, women have excelled in road racing, track cycling, mountain biking and BMX racing. Women by the name of Marianne Voss and Anna Van Der Bregen and an American, kristen Armstrong, have all won multiple world championships and Olympic medals.

Speaker 3: 19:16

Kristen 1984. Really, yes, she won 1984. Yeah, that was actually the first Olympics that women participated in cycling events, and they did road racing and BMX, if I remember correctly. Ok, and I believe that is where she won the gold.

Speaker 2: 19:37

This is something I know, that you know, but I am just kind of kind of educating myself is but did you know that Tour de France has Tour de Femmes? You know, I do.

Speaker 3: 19:49

It just recently started the last few years and what I think is really cool. You know me, I'm a big fan of the Tour de France. I you know July is my month for sports. I watch it faithfully. It's been interesting because the last two years they've really been promoting it because it happens to, it happens immediately following the men's tour and it's like two weeks long and they will mix in. A lot of times they'll cut off from the race and they'll show you, like you know racer, racers profiles and where they're from and things like that. They've started mixing in a lot of the women's profiles, so kind of introduces them to the people watching the Tour de France. So that's, that's awesome.

Speaker 2: 20:31

So Women have also been pushing for equal pay and representation. Advocates have campaigned for equal prize money and opportunities for women in cycling. There's an organization called the International L's and they have been instrumental for pushing for equality and cycling, so that was interesting to me. So there have been many women who have broke records. They've broken numerous records in cycling. For instance, denise Mueller Cornek set the PACE bicycle land speed record in 2018. Any, any guesses of how fast this land speed record of this woman was Land speed record on a bicycle, on a bicycle yeah, so that's a lot of people who have been pushing for equal pay.

Speaker 3: 21:21

Hmm, well, I know how what my fastest has been, and that's a shade over 50 and that's downhill. So I'm going to say that and you know I'm by no means an expert here, so I'm going to say 75 miles an hour.

Speaker 2: 21:41

You would be really far off. Hmm, 183 miles an hour and, to be exact, the record is 183.932 miles an hour, or what is 296 kilometers an hour on a specifically designed bicycle.

Speaker 3: 22:05

On a bicycle, not a motorcycle. A bicycle A hundred. I get to go in 50 some miles an hour down the hill. I'm just praying to God I don't hit a rock. I cannot even imagine going over a hundred miles, let alone 180 miles an hour. I don't care how designed the bicycle is, man, that's just scary stuff. Right there. I mean kudos to her, congratulations, but wow.

Speaker 2: 22:30

I did 54 miles an hour last year in Georgia. My wife looks on Strava because she's paying attention from home and she thinks you don't want her paying attention to Exactly. She said what are you doing? I said, hey, I had a helmet on, so Wow. And then I picture this is like over three times of how fast I was going, but anyway so.

Speaker 3: 22:54

That's incredible.

Speaker 2: 22:56

So women have been pushing for advocacy and leadership. They've taken leadership roles advocating for greater representation and cycling governance. Personalities like Catherine, bertine and Mary and Voss have been very vocal advocates for the gender equality in the sport. So that was news to me, to be honest. So, hmm, very interesting. They are inspired. A lot of women are taking what they've learned and instead of just saying, ok, well, we're going to fight for our equality and diversity and cycling, they're actually trying to be inspiring to the next generation of young ladies and women and serve as inspiration and pushing for more initiatives and programs to encourage more girls to take up cycling in the sport, which you and I have seen.

Speaker 2: 23:49

The dream team and not only Georgia, but Iowa and Bragg and Raghgray had a lot of ladies for their dream team. It was really cool to see. I remember one of the coaches distinctly saying ladies, ladies over here on the right side, remember what I told you, definitely being a good coach. So so there's a lot of innovation and technology. You kind of mentioned this. I don't want to steal your thunder, but they've been involved in advanced cycling technology, such as changing the frame. The female engineers and designers and scientists have contributed to not only bike gear clothing, but things like even ladies shoes. Before, like you mentioned, there was a subset of men's gear. Men's gear excuse me, but they've been looking at ladies feet being maybe different size or or maybe the width or whatever, and so a lot, of, a lot of scientists are getting involved in helping advance the sport and technology. No more.

Speaker 2: 24:55

No more, shrink it and pink, it huh, no, no, no. But a lot of community engagement which brought us, brought me back after I'm going to. I'm going to tell you what I learned first. But women cyclists have also built a supportive communities and networks, a lot of training, mentorship in the community to push, you know, by going either to their work and saying, hey, you know, we're going, we're going to go cycling on Saturday morning, why don't you join us? And we'll, you know, bring you along. But that reminded me of when you and I went to the broke spoke and how they had. Oh yeah, that's awesome. And Wednesday nights was for ladies.

Speaker 3: 25:31

Wednesday nights was Fem night. Okay, yes, yeah, and so they can. They can go work on their bicycles without you know guys around or you know. No, there's no guys showing off trying to pick up anybody, anything like that. They can just focus on the bicycle.

Speaker 2: 25:50

And women have recently, and probably more than probably more now recently, but from my readings, women have undertaken impressive endurance challenges such as ultra distance races, long distance cycling tours, record breaking rides and showcasing their strength and determination in the sport. And you and I have seen that on these state long rides We've seen some of the same people, some of the same ladies who are, who are you know, we've seen them in Iowa and then we've seen them in Kentucky and Georgia and all kinds of places. So we are seeing more women when we're out there.

Speaker 3: 26:27

So yeah, you know and a perfect example of that is our guest that we had on two, two episodes ago, sarah Yep, I mean, she's out there, she's killing it. I mean, you know, she rode across the United States. For God's sakes, I mean that's awesome.

Speaker 2: 26:44

And then there are initiatives like La Course, which is by tour de France and UCI women's world tour, contribute to increase visibility and recognize women's cycling, helping bridge the gap between men and women's racing. And so, and that's pretty much the research that I kind of looked into, trying to trying to see where, where we are now with with women's cycling, some of the tri bikes that you see, built for women, are just absolutely amazing and you'd never, you'd really never, know that there were a ladies bike or not. I mean, you never know. I mean I see all kinds of different cycles on different color bikes and now they're making, like Trek, I know they have the project one. You could, you could paint it however you want to paint it flames and you know unicorns and whatever. So so a lot of, a lot of equality across the, across the board when it comes to that. So just wanted to, you know, just kind of get that out there and and kind of bring attention to women's cycling and continue the cycling women of leisure series.

Speaker 3: 27:53

No, I think this is a great topic when you pull. When you brought it up, you know, I I was like that might go good and then, once I started doing the research, I was like wow. So I think the bottom line is ladies, get out and get out and do some cycling. I mean, things are becoming a lot less restrictive as far as getting into the sport and certainly society is far more accepting of it than it was a hundred years ago.

Speaker 2: 28:18

So that's awesome. So you're going to get the ladies in your house cycling.

Speaker 3: 28:26

That would be nice. You know they just yeah, I love cycling so much and they're kind of like, eh, it's cycling and I get it. They're not going to have the enthusiasm that maybe I have for it, but maybe one of these days.

Speaker 2: 28:43

So I always tease our good friend Joe. His daughters are extremely talented in dance and have won many awards and lots of scholarships and done some phenomenal things with their dancing. And I always tease him. I'm like, when do you even get those ladies on bikes? And he says, well, I can get them out for like a you know one ride here or one ride there. And I said no, no, put your foot down. Stop buying all the dance, dad. You know, outfits and all the things you're telling me that are expensive, and go out and buy him a bike, you know. And I think he said that goes over like a lead balloon.

Speaker 3: 29:21

The problem, though? One of the problems is Joe likes to ride fast, yeah, and I could see if you're somebody. I mean, I've ridden with Joe, he blows out and just goes. But I mean, if you're like somebody, it's like, hey, let's go out and ride, and then you're like blowing down the road at 20 miles an hour. Yeah, I could see where that might not be so fun. So slow down, joe, invite him out and slow down.

Speaker 2: 29:46

When Joe and I were training for our first rag bra I don't know if I ever told you this We'd go to a place over here called Island Lake in Kensington Metro Park. They, they connect. We're lucky here. We have a trail system that is so vast that you never have to go through traffic, or, if you do it so minimal, we're just out of trail crossing, and so we're pretty lucky to train. There's lots of elevations, and I and Joe would say hey you want to go out and train.

Speaker 2: 30:12

I say, oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, you know, I want to, I want to be ready for, ready for Iowa. And we, we get to the parking lot and we, you know, stage our bikes and get everything ready to go. And you know, for about the first lap or so, I could keep up with them and after a while I started getting really exhausted. And then what he would do is, um, he'd get to the top and he this is no secret, by the way, he knows I would tell the story, but he would get to the top of the hill and he'd wait for me, which is polite, except why I would get to the top of the hill. He's like, okay, let's go. And I'm like, well, wait a minute, you got your rest, yeah.

Speaker 1: 30:45

Where's my?

Speaker 2: 30:46

rest. I need a break, and so, uh, after a while, I would just tell him just just go on, I'll.

Speaker 3: 30:52

I'll catch you later. Let me die along this side of the trail, that's right.

Speaker 2: 30:57

Just get the defibrillator out of the truck and and we'll be fine. So, but yeah, he's definitely a strong rider and you're right about that. My goal is to get Lauren back on the bike this year. Yep, you know, you know that she was doing midnight for a long time and then now she changed jobs to an eight to five money through Friday, and so that's my goal is, I don't I don't expect her to do the crazy shenanigans like you and I do, but no, you know, she used to really enjoy it. I mean, she's done 70 mile rides and, um, when her mom passed away, she honored her mom and did a, did a 70 mile ride that day and honor her mother, and so, uh, I think she misses it and it's got a nice trek on the wall that I that's, uh, I can blow the dust off. So maybe that, maybe that'll be one of the cycling women of leisure series shows there you go.

Speaker 3: 31:45

So what else do we got for this episode Anything, all right yeah.

Speaker 2: 31:51

I thought, if you would, just, if you would just, you know, just just just, let me wait wait, wait.

Speaker 3: 31:58

Well, I'm throwing the flag. I know you guys can't see me, but on my desk I have a yellow referee flag. I'm throwing it right now. Boom, there it is, because you know what this is reminding me. That is exactly the same way you started this whole thing. You were like, uh, uh, I tell you what. Just get bear with me for a minute. I got this, this crazy idea and don't make any judgment. Have you ever thought about doing a podcast? So now you're getting me a little worried because that is exactly the same way you started us down this road.

Speaker 2: 32:34

I thought I have a few things that are on my chest that we could start a new segment, a segment that could be reappearing not every episode, maybe not every three episodes. Are we talking about your shirts?

Speaker 3: 32:49

or what. No, no, everybody knows.

Speaker 2: 32:51

You said it's on your chest I mean, I thought, okay, everybody knows I have crazy golf shirts, but no, no, no, okay, I'm, I have, I'm thinking I have a few things like a rant. I want like rants, oh man.

Speaker 3: 33:07

A rant? Rants of what Disatisfaction.

Speaker 2: 33:10

Yeah, I thought we could call it rants of dissatisfaction. I like it. That's cool Okay.

Speaker 3: 33:16

So airing of the laundry, or yeah, yep.

Speaker 2: 33:20

This is going to. This is clearly not going to be a cycling topic, but could relate to cycling if you're willing to take a stretch.

Speaker 3: 33:31

Okay.

Speaker 2: 33:32

All right Let us.

Speaker 3: 33:33

let us then begin the first rants of dissatisfaction. Perfect, we need some theme music next time, though no.

Speaker 2: 33:44

I can, I'll bust up some theme music. I will. I will work on that, who knows, Maybe I'll just edit this and be like you mean this right here. Rants of dissatisfaction when people make you mad.

Speaker 3: 34:03

This ought to be good. Stay tuned, folks. I'm going to run for the ride.

Speaker 2: 34:08

As you know, I live in the great state of Michigan. I'm actually proud to live in Michigan and it is not a surprise every year that it snows Sometime in 2024, it's already happened in 23 a couple of times but sometime in 2024, it's gonna snow. And when it does, it's amazing to me that everyone's like oh my gosh, this is the first time I've ever seen snow and I don't know how to drive. I'm not sure about you, but over here snows and everybody just loses their brain. It's just amazing to me and I thought that kind of led me down the path. I'm not sure what about you in Kansas, when the first time it snows is people slip off the road or drive too fast for conditions.

Speaker 3: 34:59

Yes, absolutely. Now we don't get as much snow as you do, obviously, but, yeah, that first snow like we had a few days ago. You know, you're right, everybody kind of freaks out. They've got to, I think, acclimate to the concept of oh, we live in a state that it snows. We were hoping that wasn't going to happen this year. Surprise, it did. But yes, I do agree with you, people have a tendency to like go crazy.

Speaker 3: 35:27

I will say I spent 13 years in Denver, colorado, and my, I guess my rant. At this point in time I'm going to interrupt your rant. I'm going to throw a rant out there. I'm in, I'm in Every other weekend or every weekend.

Speaker 3: 35:43

I love to ski and when I was there, I was generally a season ticket holder of one of the resorts and so I would go up into the mountains a lot and it was funny.

Speaker 3: 35:54

You know, you would always see. You know, a lot of times the conditions were bad and you would see, like you know, cars off to the side. What was amazing to me is, 99.9% of the time, the cars in the ditch were cars with four-wheel drive, because for some reason, those people who own four-wheel drives thinks that a four-wheel drive cannot get stuck and it can go through anything and they can drive as fast as they want because somehow it magically gives them super traction. And so yeah, exactly, I've got super traction, I got four-wheel drive, and you'd see all these like you know little Toyotas and all this other stuff going up there not having any trouble, and then you'd see these big, you know four-wheel drive trucks and stuff off in the ditch or whatever that always it's like. Come on, just cause you have a four-wheel drive does not magically make you invincible to snow conditions.

Speaker 2: 36:51

So you know I drive a little Honda. It's a front-wheel drive. I would challenge that. It can almost go anywhere. And I am the same way when people pass me, like on a big expedition, and then later I see them in a ditch. There's a sense of satisfaction there. I wave as I go by, bye-bye. So that's kind of where I'm going with this. So I have a few here.

Speaker 3: 37:18

So excuse me the rants of dissatisfaction.

Speaker 2: 37:24

That's right.

Speaker 3: 37:25

It's going to be an area or an opportunity for us to air our grievances at anything.

Speaker 2: 37:32

Absolutely. So this got me thinking I will keep them this current session of rants of dissatisfaction. I will keep them road worthy, because it could involve cycling as well. So I'm trying to do a stretch there. But here's another one. Okay, you're on the freeway, whether it's a two-lane highway or a three-lane highway, or who knows, maybe you're in LA and it's an eight-lane highway. You're in the right lane. Yeah, you're going. The speed limit can't get over to your left. The guy comes down the ramp. Who has the right of way?

Speaker 3: 38:08

Well, legally, the flow of the traffic has the right of way. You're coming into the flow of the traffic. You should be yielding if yield is necessary.

Speaker 2: 38:18

Oh, I agree, but the guy coming down the ramp is yelling at you because you're not.

Speaker 3: 38:24

You're not yielding, that's right. Let me slow down and stop traffic on the interstate at 70, 80 miles an hour so that you can get into the traffic. That's right. I totally get that. You're absolutely right. Yeah.

Speaker 2: 38:36

That just drives me nuts, because I take a three-lane freeway all the way to work every day and when I get on to my little city, after getting my Starbucks which is extremely important and as I come up the ramp, I know that they have the right of way and I wait my turn. But it's amazing, on the next ramp, where I'm minding my own business, I got the cruise control on normally, got an AirPods in, listen to a podcast. Sometimes I'm even listening to our podcast to make sure how it sounds and then someone comes on the ramp and they give you the double arms up and you're like what do you do?

Speaker 3: 39:14

I can do one better. Okay, same situation. I'm up there. I'm coming down the on-ramp. I see there's a lot of cars they can't get over. So I am slowing down to yield. The guy behind me hits his horn, steps on the gas, zips around me and just like slides in right between two cars.

Speaker 2: 39:35

Yeah, that annoys me.

Speaker 3: 39:36

That and it's like, dude, I'm doing what I'm supposed to do and you just about created an accident by you. It's like trying to slipstream between two cars there. That bothers me.

Speaker 2: 39:45

Another guy who got stuck in a ditch. I would smile as I drove by. All right, I got another one. You either are on highway or you're your local byway or whatever, and you're giving the ample space that you're supposed to Two car lengths, three car lengths, depending on the daylight, depending on the weather. You're giving that equal space and then this guy comes around you to only turn after passing you, to immediately make a right turn, right away, like really, dude, you had to come. So let me explain that.

Speaker 1: 40:25

Okay, let's say you go on 50, 55,.

Speaker 2: 40:29

And then there's a turn off to the right and this guy zips around you just to be able to turn right.

Speaker 3: 40:35

To slow down and turn to the right, right Like zip in front of you, and then turn to the right, exactly a little frustrating. You've done that to me before, by the way I did. Yeah, you did exactly. Where's that flag at? I'm throwing it again.

Speaker 2: 40:54

You are. Is it red? No, yours is yellow.

Speaker 3: 40:56

Mine's yellow we need the challenge flag to be red.

Speaker 2: 41:02

I don't deny it, though the difference is. But those commercials are the best commercials. I love it. It says I didn't leave the sunroom up.

Speaker 3: 41:09

Oh yeah, challenge flag, challenge flag. All right, here's another one, let's go to the replay.

Speaker 2: 41:14

Well, in that case I definitely did turn before you. So we were trying to find the place to park and I turned before him and you did circles. But I came back and my defense Okay, this is another one that bothers me. You're driving, there's a big sign that says left lane ends in one mile. I'm the kind of guy that, oh gosh. I'm the kind of guy that's like all right, I better get over. I better get over, I better find me a spot and I try to get over it. Just when a guy comes all the way at the end, at the last second, and then expects like to come on over, the best thing about driving a 13 year old car is I'm not letting you over.

Speaker 3: 42:08

That's right. Yeah, I yeah, totally, you know I can. I can agree with that one too. And the last one I had was the emergency lane.

Speaker 2: 42:18

the emergency lane and someone thinking that, oh, there's traffic here, I'm just gonna whip on over to the emergency lane and I'm just gonna race off the freeway because I have the right to.

Speaker 3: 42:30

Now just a second. When you say emergency lane, are you talking the shoulder?

Speaker 2: 42:33

Yeah, shoulder. In Michigan we have emergency lane. The shoulder are the same thing. Okay, Sorry, I should have been more clear.

Speaker 3: 42:39

No, that's okay, so they basically, traffic is going slow or stopped and they hop over into the shoulder and drive down the shoulder.

Speaker 2: 42:48

Yeah, special place in hell for those people. Yeah, yes, yes, yes, yes, In my opinion.

Speaker 1: 42:54

So and then that's it.

Speaker 2: 42:57

That's my that's. I thought we could have a segment of things that have been just kind of building up. A few things happen here or there and I thought, you know, I wonder if we could tie this into the show. And I guarantee you that you and I are not the only people who ever talk about people merging or, like you said, the four-wheel drive. It's funny because every time it snows here, people on the freeway like blow by me. My dad always says four-wheel drive so you can get stuck in deeper snow.

Speaker 3: 43:22

That's exactly it. Oh well, why we're on ranting? Okay, I've got one that is cycling related Cool, and I guarantee I bet every single one of our listeners has been there. Drives me crazy. All right, Actually, two of them. The person who is passing you as you're cycling.

Speaker 3: 43:39

they're in a car and right as they get up next to you, they just gun the gas and go really fast, Like they're proving to you that their car is faster than your bike, which I'm like, oh, I hope your car is faster than me on a bike. Yeah, so the second one is said person doing that, but instead of stepping on the gas and zipping around, they work on getting their mirror in their car as close to you as humanly possible to try to prove that they own the road. That just pisses me off beyond belief. It's like, okay, there's plenty of room. Wasn't another car coming? You could have easily went over? And instead of going over a little to your left, you decide to try to crowd me as much as you could to the right without you know.

Speaker 2: 44:29

I believe that happened to us many times on the ride that we don't speak about.

Speaker 3: 44:34

Yes, on the ride that we do not speak about because we're nice guys and we've often said if there's rides that we go on, that we absolutely that was unsafe or anything like that, that we will not bad mouth the ride. We just won't mention or talk about the ride. Certainly, you know, catch us in person sometime, we'll be happy to talk about it.

Speaker 2: 44:57

But yes, and we did talk about it recently with a boy and had a commonality with somebody who had the same feeling that we were talking about said the same thing about the ride.

Speaker 3: 45:09

So, yeah, you're absolutely right. I mean, there were several times there that it wasn't just vehicles, it was semis and in their defense, though, a lot of that was. It was just a busy, you know, single lane of traffic and there was really not a lot of room for those big trucks to go anywhere when they were passing you and, honestly, we had a non existent shoulder, or a you know eight inch shoulder, to try to work off of.

Speaker 2: 45:39

So that was where the radar became instrumental that day on the ride that we don't speak about. Yes, absolutely. So that's it. Now. You've kind of challenged me. I am going to have a sound effect, this one right here. Rance of dissatisfaction when people make you mad, and I'll close. Rance of dissatisfaction.

Speaker 3: 46:06

OK, excellent, I love it.

Speaker 2: 46:08

You know, as Rance come up, we can Air our grievances, so to speak, being being truthful stole the idea of listening to a radio station and and and this guy was talking about hey, how do you feel about this? I'm sure they were trying to have a topic to have people call into the radio station, but while I know that this is not a live podcast, I thought it'll still be fun. Just to say these are kind of some things that you know driving to work every day. So I think I know that your commute is 13 steps, but, yeah, don't make me rant about that Because let me tell you if they're trying to go up those 13 steps and I'm trying to go down.

Speaker 3: 46:46

Oh, it gets messy, so you trip in the yeah you know, my milk and my breakfast go fly. It's horrible.

Speaker 2: 46:55

I just heard your daughter yell at you about hitting dishes, so that was great.

Speaker 3: 47:01

Well, I haven't had a lot of time for my work day to this and you know, I was eating lunch and I said I'm there and I will take them up, and she tends to be the. You know she understands that. If she did it, I would be on her case, so it's fair.

Speaker 2: 47:15

And, truth be told, we're trying to work on something really cool We've got. Can't say a lot right now, but we've got. We've got something really cool coming out January 1st, we're OK.

Speaker 3: 47:26

I was going to say is that what we're talking about?

Speaker 2: 47:28

Yeah, don't, don't say what it is, but no, no, no no, no, no, no.

Speaker 3: 47:33

I am super excited, me too. If we make this happen, yeah, this will be super cool. It'll be. Just keep tuning in, because if we make this work, it's going to be awesome. It's going to be a great show, great topic. It'll be awesome.

Speaker 2: 47:53

January 1st.

Speaker 3: 47:54

January 1st and that's going to be a special episode. Yeah and yeah, big, big exciting cool things.

Speaker 2: 48:05

So we've got some, got some great stuff coming up.

Speaker 3: 48:07

So oh, speaking of great stuff, we've got, I think, a couple of episodes before our final episode. Is that correct? That's correct For the year end.

Speaker 2: 48:21

Yeah, this is going to come out. I hate to date it, but I'll date it. This is this should come out on the 10th of December, so if you're, listening to this today and this is the day that it came out. You can be like hey, no, it's not. Today is the 11th. Technically, it came out on the 10th.

Speaker 3: 48:37

So the next episode is going. I think it's going to be a lot of fun.

Speaker 2: 48:43

It'll be on the 24th Christmas 24th.

Speaker 3: 48:45

Christmas Eve we're going to have a really fun. We're going to basically be doing kind of a best of 2023. And I've got some interesting questions to pose to you that I'm going to have you answer and I'm going to give you some questions of which you can pose to me, and we're going to kind of evaluate some of the best things that we've did during the year.

Speaker 2: 49:10

I'm looking forward to that. It should be fun. I think what happens for me is Even listening to it. Sometimes I'm like, oh yeah, we did do that. I mean, we pack so much into the year and then you know, you have a family, you do vacation with your family, and then we do our cycling and trips and, of course, the golf trip and everything. And so sometimes when we do this, I'm always like, oh yeah, we did do that, you're right. Or we, oh yeah, we did go there. So I'm really looking forward to that.

Speaker 3: 49:39

So I'm putting it in a fun format. I think we're going to have a lot of fun with it. I think the listeners will enjoy it.

Speaker 2: 49:46

Well, and, by the way, on that show when it comes out on Christmas Eve, I mean you know you get tired of your family. Put on your AirPods, put on your noise cancellation headphones and just go listen to the guys. I mean it'll be, it'll be something you want to do, so awesome, Awesome.

Speaker 3: 50:04

Good stuff coming up.

Speaker 2: 50:06

I'm going to do a little plug here. So behind me I know this is a podcast and you can't see it, but I'm going to describe it Behind me is an Instagram counter and a Facebook counter, and we just want to thank those who have followed us and and helping the numbers flip. If you've ever been to a restaurant or some sort of store and you see on the wall there's looks like a number and you say, hey, what's that? You know you, and if you like the Facebook, like or you follow an Instagram, this thing will actually flip right away. And so we've definitely gained some, some Instagram and some Facebook followers. We're looking for anybody else that can help us so we can push the show more and share what we got going on.

Speaker 3: 50:52

So really I would love that that support the final thing I'll say also, as everybody probably knows, at this point in time we are going back to Georgia, big Bragg Going to Georgia. We are looking for team members for cycling men and cycling women of leisure, and you know so anybody out there who wants to go to Big Bragg and hang out can certainly sign up. Our team is in the registration where you select your team. Our team name is on there. I did want to mention that there is a discount for registration. If you get it done before December 31st, that is saved like 75 bucks. So it is something to keep in mind. If you're, if you know you're going to be registering for Big Bragg, you might as well save yourself the seventy five dollars.

Speaker 2: 51:42

And you might as well just join our team, because if we have more than 10, you'll get a jersey. And why wouldn't you want to hang out with the cycling men and women of leisure? I mean, that's kind of why you're there.

Speaker 3: 51:53

See there, those are the questions you probably shouldn't ask. Why, why wouldn't you want to hang out with us?

Speaker 2: 51:59

Well, yeah, well listen, I think about this. You can come and hang out with us.

Speaker 3: 52:06

Let's not put it in a form of a question? You can come out and hang out with us and cycle and have a good time. How about that? Have a good time? How about that?

Speaker 2: 52:15

We've been known to pass out bourbon. We've been known to enjoy lots of good things, so come and join us, is what I would say. Absolutely Well, that's it Cool. So I appreciate you doing your part of the show and research, and good to see you again, as always.

Speaker 3: 52:35

So, and I appreciate not being replaced with AI, so thank you.

Speaker 2: 52:39

No, no, I told you that the CEO of Chad GBT had to step down and and I'm not sure if they figured somebody out, but even if they do replace the CEO, or whatever happens, I still want your brother, so I appreciate that man.

Speaker 3: 52:57

We want to do it without you.

Speaker 2: 52:59

No. So I know one thing I wish it was a great day for a bike ride. Unfortunately, today here it's not, but I'm visual, visualizing and planning for for a great day for a bike ride.

Speaker 3: 53:16

Well, every day is a great day for a bike ride somewhere. Somewhere is not.

Speaker 2: 53:24

Michigan, but somewhere. And trust me when I tell you Facebook and Google and all those places keep showing me blue waters and beaches. I think they want me to get out my credit card and go somewhere. So that would be a great day to ride a bike for sure. Absolutely, Thank you.

Speaker 3: 53:42

Hey, have a good one you too.

Speaker 1: 53:46

Thank you for coming along with Adam and Michael on road adventures with cycling men of leisure. If you have enjoyed this, please subscribe to the show on the podcast app of your choice.